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Post by bcjammerx on Sept 27, 2021 14:27:55 GMT
I have a machine giving me this error;
malfunction of chamber system sensors
balance chamber msbk sensors and valves seem to be cycling properly, not sure where to start diagnosing this one
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Post by bcjammerx on Sept 28, 2021 15:05:29 GMT
put in a request with bbraun tech support so we'll see what they say
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joey
Full Member
Posts: 226
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Post by joey on Sept 28, 2021 15:44:06 GMT
I can only speak on the Version 8 machines but sometimes it is because the posts for the membranes are corroded or broken
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Post by Admin on Sept 28, 2021 19:06:13 GMT
Malfunction of chamber system sensors 99% of the time - especially on new machines - is caused by air in the system. It becomes trapped in the BC and it cannot be compressed so it has a hard time removing it.
It's looking to keep an even flow in the system and if MSBK 1/2 is off by 5,000 uS from each other, it throws this alarm. So check the functionality of MSBK 1/2 and for air. Check the DF filter, and also the FPE and FPA to see if they are weak.
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Post by bcjammerx on Oct 4, 2021 13:46:45 GMT
bbraun said either faulty msbk1/2 or board or air in the system. I didn't see air and I also let the machine rinse for 30 minutes and it still did it.
BUT I just had another machine pulled for the same alarm, haven't had a chance to check it out yet but this has me thinking something else is going on...maybe I just need to do a balance chamber calibration?
I plan to replace the sensors and boards, I'll make note of the posts too
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Post by Admin on Oct 4, 2021 15:44:48 GMT
Good work. Give a BC Cal a try first before replacing parts
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Post by yourmrfixitva on Oct 5, 2021 16:48:43 GMT
First I'd look to see how many hours/treatments are left on the DF filter. If in question or hours/treatments are close replace and disinfect it. Then look at your throttle pressures. Make sure your throttles (or in my words pressure relieve valve) are not low. If pressure or pump is weak it won't be able to move the balancing chamber membranes over far enough. I've found FPE is usually the issue but I like to replace both (due to usually the same hours on the pumps) as a preventative maintenance.
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btech
New Member
Posts: 43
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Post by btech on Oct 6, 2021 9:27:04 GMT
Just a small info about this alarm.
The alarm "malfunction chamber system sensor error" indicates that the chamber sensors are out of range or the range between the sensors is to small/big. The alarm is self acknowledging.
The alarm "DF flow disturbed(membrane moving)" is issued when the machine needs to long to fill the chambers for more than 10 cycles.
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Post by SrCusEngr on Oct 10, 2021 17:15:02 GMT
I have seen the Malfunction of Chamber sensors caused by wiring problems. Just recently, while testing a problem machine, I observed MSBK2 value to go from 16000 to 50000, very erratically. The customer had already replaced the MSBK boards with no affect. The problem was traced to a unsecured wire in a harness connector. The locking tabs on the pin were not projecting out far enough from the body to secure it in place within the harness connector body. After approximately 2000 hrs on the machine, it worked free just enough to start causing problems. Spreading the tabs and making sure it was locked in place, the machine worked like a champ.
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Post by bcjammerx on Nov 4, 2021 13:55:43 GMT
THANKS AGAIN FOR THE REPLIES!!! VERY useful info!
update...I misread the JIRA response, they only said to replace msbk1 or 2. Well I ended up replacing the boards AND both msbk's...however they are still reading 2000 difference between their maxes however the alarm stopped.
Unfortunately my v8's don't have the software to calibrate msbk sensors (bc calibration). They are reading exactly what they were reading before I replaced both boards and both msbk sensors...the membranes didn't appear to have buildup on them but if I get this alarm again on either of these machines (again which now no longer display the error yet msbk1/2 values haven't changed) then I'll replace the membranes but so far this hasn't come up.
I did just get this alarm on a third machine (another v8) but it had sat for a while so I'm disinfecting it, rinsing, and will try again
I was told this could also be the result of air in the system which makes sense given what others have said so I'll hope that's what it is on this last one...I'll see what it does here in about 5 min.
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Post by Chuck Weddle on Nov 4, 2021 14:14:18 GMT
I've found that with the Braun machines, the cause of a problem is usually the easiest (most common). Very rarely is it something off-the-wall. In your case, I think you're on the right track with it being caused by air. The tricky part is tracking down the source.
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Post by SrCusEngr on Nov 5, 2021 1:32:48 GMT
I also do not think you have to:
1. Worry about your Ver 8 machine not having a BC calibration function. The software in that machine is not capable of performing that task.
2. Worry about a difference of 2000 between your MSBK boards. Each board is unique. The range numbers have a lower and upper limit. MSBK1/2 must not be less than 11,000 us and not greater than 34,000 us. And the difference between the minimum and maximum values must be greater than 5,500 us. So one chamber could read 14,000 (low) and 20,000 (high) and work because it meets the requirements [not less than 11000; not greater than 34000; difference is more than 5500].
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Post by Ddman on Sept 22, 2022 18:39:04 GMT
Did you ever find the problem? And if it occurred only during set up?
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Post by bcjammerx on Sept 22, 2022 18:49:35 GMT
Did you ever find the problem? And if it occurred only during set up? this particular machine never gave me the error again, but I basically rebuilt the entire balance chamber system...I can't recall 100% whether I replaced the membranes too but I do recall pulling a couple and noting the ends were corroded and one even bent so I think I did, sorry, I have so many repairs, this was a while ago and my memory is not so great :\ I did have a 9.12 today where the tech said it gave her this error during setup but she plugged her acid wand back in and rinsed and it went away. I'd do as suggested, start with a rinse then suspect the membranes (well the rods/posts used by msbk1/2 that is). just remember to put a towel on your lap when taking the chamber apart to inspect them XD |
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