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Post by Falcon on Oct 7, 2021 4:36:38 GMT
What's the meaning of End ratio and End ratio limit?
When we are changing a concentrate type from say 36.83x to 45x, what are the steps followed in TSM, will the machine be recalibrated every time when such a change is made?
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btech
Junior Member
Posts: 55
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Post by btech on Oct 7, 2021 15:04:37 GMT
Hello Falcon, you only need to adjust the EndLF ratio one time.
If you use 1+44 concentrate you should set it to 38. With 38 you can use both types 1+34 and 1+44 without getting any ratio alarms.
You can find the informations about the settings in the service manual.
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Post by SrCusEngr on Oct 7, 2021 22:15:12 GMT
When you change from 36.83x (bicarb with NaCl) to 45x (Bicarb w/o NaCl), you will have to make several changed in TSM.
1. In System Configuration, Dialysate Side Parameters (first selection):
a. There are two settings in this screen, one for Bicarb with NaCl and one for Bicarb w/o NaCl. Make sure the later is set to dark green background.
b. Press the "Bicarb" icon in that box.
c. Insure the correct value of bicarb is set. Since you are changing from 36.83x (range is from 4.0 to 8.0 mS/cm) to 45x (range is from 2.0 to 4.0 mS/cm), you will need to determine the proper bicarb level you desire. The medical Director should provide his desired level to you.
d. Now press the ACID icon. Enter the mS/cm value for the desired final conductivity given to you by the Medical Director.
e. Now press the Save and Exit icon.
2. In LLC Manual Calibrations, test 2.10 BICLF and ENDLF ratio:
a. Make sure the settings are BICLF 25; ENDLF 38. If the BIC Cartridge is present, it must be set to 35.
There should not be a need to recalibrate the conductivity cells, if they were calibrated per the instructions in the service manual.
After completion, you should run a mock therapy and verify that your machine conductivity is within the proper tolerance with an external meter.
As for the reason for the ratios, remember, the acid and bicarb pump run in a servo system. In simple terms, the bicarb pump spins at a certain rate that insures a proper mixture of fluid mixes with the water to produce a certain conductivity. If the bicarb is too weak the pump will spin faster to maintain the conductivity. Opposite if too strong. The ratio and +/- limits are just a means to determine if if the speed is within an appropriate range of operation. Reaching a limit is telling you that there is a problem with the delivery or the concentrate that needs to be checked.
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Post by Falcon on Oct 8, 2021 11:38:21 GMT
Hello Falcon, you only need to adjust the EndLF ratio one time. If you use 1+44 concentrate you should set it to 38. With 38 you can use both types 1+34 and 1+44 without getting any ratio alarms. You can find the informations about the settings in the service manual. Can you please provide service manual file. |
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Post by Guest on Oct 8, 2021 12:27:50 GMT
What does Biclf and Endlf denotes, if we see their default vaues i.e 25(Biclf) and 31(Endlf), what do these values mean.
How Does theses numbers correlation with
35x concentrate.
Moderator comment: This post is by the same person using the name "Falcon". Please don't be confused.
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Post by Chuck Weddle on Oct 8, 2021 13:53:31 GMT
Hello Falcon, you only need to adjust the EndLF ratio one time. If you use 1+44 concentrate you should set it to 38. With 38 you can use both types 1+34 and 1+44 without getting any ratio alarms. You can find the informations about the settings in the service manual. Can you please provide service manual file. Falcon, The service manual can only be shared with trained/certified technicians. |
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Post by Falcon on Oct 8, 2021 14:17:08 GMT
What does Biclf and Endlf denotes, if we see their default vaues i.e 25(Biclf) and 31(Endlf), what do these values mean. How Does theses numbers correlation with 35x concentrate. Moderator comment: This post is by the same person using the name "Falcon". Please don't be confused. yeah Sorry for that. Please anyone reply, to above post. |
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Post by joey on Oct 8, 2021 15:58:54 GMT
You might want to consider changing one ahead of time and drawing a sample to send to the lab for validation purposes so you know you are providing the levels you desire
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Post by Falcon on Oct 8, 2021 20:09:53 GMT
What does Bic ratio and End ratio denotes? if we see their default vaues i.e 25(Bicb ratio) and 31(End ratio), what do these values mean.
How Does theses numbers correlation with
35x concentrate?
Sorry for my earlier post, writing biclf and endlf in place of ratios.
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Post by SrCusEngr on Oct 10, 2021 16:30:54 GMT
Please read the last paragraph of my previous post.
Also, if you are an operator of the machine and not trained to repair the machine, you must not go into the machine and start making adjustments. All trained technicians are mindful that when they fix, adjust, calibrate or make any other changes to a machine, the end result is insuring patient safety. Technicians are trained ON and ABOUT the machine. They are NOT clinicians and it is not within their provenance to know the clinical aspects of the machine. If you do not have the equipment training or specific equipment needed to maintain the machine, you cannot insure that what you may want to do will insure patient safety. It is good and proper to understand what the machine is telling you is happening, however.
Were you given an Operator's Manual (also known as the Instructions for Use)? There is a lot of important information in there.
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Post by Falcon on Oct 11, 2021 10:45:03 GMT
Anybody pls reply...
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btech
Junior Member
Posts: 55
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Post by btech on Oct 11, 2021 12:05:01 GMT
Dear Falcon, there is a particular reason why only trained tech´s will get the Service Manual for dialysis machines.
BBraun only allows trained technicians to work on their machines. This a not a coffee machine or an Iron this is a medical device and in one way it is an artifical organ.
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Post by Falcon on Oct 12, 2021 6:10:15 GMT
Dear Falcon, there is a particular reason why only trained tech´s will get the Service Manual for dialysis machines. BBraun only allows trained technicians to work on their machines. This a not a coffee machine or an Iron this is a medical device and in one way it is an artifical organ. Totally agree with you guys, however my intent is to just know what various terms concerning the machine means. Pls answer, What does Bic ratio and End ratio denotes? if we see their default vaues i.e 25(Bicb ratio) and 31(End ratio), what do these values mean. How Does theses numbers correlation with 35x concentrate? |
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btech
Junior Member
Posts: 55
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Post by btech on Oct 12, 2021 6:58:41 GMT
Ok let me answer this in the best way i can do. without beeing to technical.
A ratio is the representation of the ratio of DF flow to bicarbonate pump and / or concentrate pump. As an example, with a concentrate 1 + 44 you need 1 liter of concentrate + 1.755 liters of bicarbonate and 42.245 liters of water. So that means 1 + 44 = 1 liter of concentrate + 44 liters of bicarbonate with water. For 1 + 34 you need 1 liter of concentrate + 1.225 liters of bicarbonate and 32.775 liters of concentrate.
The BIC ratio is usually set to 25 (canister). The limits are +/- 7 so a valid number when comparing BIC pump speed to FPE pump speed with A BIC of 25 is 18 to 32. If it falls outside that range, you will have a BIC ratio alarm, because the system 'knows 'that the BIC pump speed to FPE speed is abnormal.
The cartridge ratio is set to 35, because the cartridge offers resistance to flow through it, so the BIC pump has to spin faster to get the proper amount of fluid into the system. Because it spins faster, the ratio is a higher number.
ENDLF ratio is set at 38. The limit is an upper limit and the actual value must not exceed 38.
If you want to know more details you should call US Tech Service of BBraun, i think yomeone here in this Forum will have their number
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mspk
New Member
Posts: 1
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Post by mspk on Apr 29, 2024 14:48:51 GMT
Hello Avery One I Need B Braun dialysis machine dialog Software 9.1Service/Technical Manual i have some Manual but there in no Code error details. Plz send us in PDF Copy in my email, ******************.com
thanks you in advance
MODERATORS NOTE: Email address removed. Manuals are intended for properly trained technicians only and are also copyrighted.
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